In the House: EP4 A Practice of Care W. Jeahlisa Bridgeman

Ezi  00:06

You. Yes you! You deserve to be cared for. You deserve to be taken care of. I'm extremely fortunate to have people in my life who care about me and who take care of me. Even when I'm not entirely present to that fact. One such person is Jeahlisa Bridgeman. Jeahlisa is a social worker. And I feel like she was born caring. And you know, I'm sure many of us were, if not all of us. But I think Jeahisa was born to be a carer. I'll let you hear from her about what she does. Check it out.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  01:03

Hi, my name is Jeahlisa Bridgeman, and I'm a social worker working in healthcare. I am currently working on ways to support or better support clients who have... who are living with chronic illness and have comorbid mental health concerns. I'm really passionate about supporting individuals who are going through difficult, difficult transitions and you know, kind of holding space and supporting them as they navigate and adjust to new changes in their life.

Ezi  01:42

Welcome Jeahlisa, nice to have you.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  01:45

Thank you for having me. Fun fact,

Ezi  01:48

I've known Jeahlisa since high school.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  01:53

[laughter] How many years has not been now, like 12?

Ezi  01:55

Many, many [laughter].

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  01:56

Oh, Lord. Okay. [Laughter]

Ezi  01:59

Let's not expose ourselves to the folks but many. [Laughter] I've had the pleasure of witnessing how Jeahlisa takes care of people up  close and personal, and how that's translated into the work that she's now doing. In her role as a social worker. So Jeahlisa, tell me more about your role and kind of the things that you do?

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  02:21

For sure. So as you mentioned, I'm a social worker, and I work with individuals who are living with chronic illness. So you know, my clients come from a variety of lived experiences, you know, they stem from different ethnicities, cultures, socioeconomic backgrounds, immigration status, age, genders, all walks of life. And the particular population or disease population that I support, they're living with the disease that progresses over time. So some have a quicker, quicker decline than others, which you know, is dependent on various factors. And many of these factors are out of the control of the person. Unfortunately, in addition to, you know, their primary medical diagnosis, there's a lot of other comorbid mental health conditions, too, that have overlapping symptoms. So in my role as their social worker, you know, I conduct assessments that explore their functional concerns, their ability to perform activities of daily living, like hygiene, feeding, you know, things like that. I assess the presence of support systems, look into financial challenges, their access to medications, housing, job security, lifestyle changes, you know, response to stressors. There's just a lot: hopes, dreams, goals. There's a lot of brief solution focused counseling, and adjustment, support, and crisis interventions to people and, you know, their families and caregivers who are having to learn how to live with a new disability in conjunction with just navigating their regular day to day life. You know? Their careers, their school, or academic goals, chores, relationships. So there's a lot of just talking and adjusting and counseling and support, just on that alone. A lot of advocacy work. So I mean, to be quite honest, like the role spans a lot of different hats, and it could look very different for different people. But basically, the underlying element is, you know, you have to practice empathy and compassion and you need to have really effective communication and you have to acknowledge the presence of trauma or potential presence of trauma. And you have to really build partnerships that incorporate, you know, your client's needs and values and goals. And, you know, once you can incorporate all of those things, then everything else that I mentioned beforehand, it just makes sense, it comes up naturally, because you just want to support the person where they're at.

Ezi  05:14

And I think that, you know, we often hear the title social worker, and we're just like, oh, they just help people. But we don't really think about the nuanced ways in which that happens, like, you've noted so many different things that you do in your role and you're one particular type of social worker, right? And is, as you mentioned, lots of ways in which to do social work across across spaces within the hospital. And beyond that, right, when you're within whatever healthcare setting you're in.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  05:43

Definitely.

Ezi  05:43

Yeah, so what what is an aspect of social work that you love out of all of those aspects.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  05:48

So as you mentioned, like before, social work looks different, you know, depending on the population that you're working with, or the environment that you're in. So I just, I really love how diverse the field is. And I found that even in the short amount of time that I've been a social worker, you know, each client, and each environment and role that I've been in has brought forth a lot of lessons and learnings, I always pull something from every client interaction that I have. And, you know, I just in general, I just enjoy working in a profession that really embodies all of my own personal values. It doesn't feel like work if you actually believe in what you're doing. And you genuinely want to support and help people. So, you know, just respect and service to others, social justice, equity, inclusion, and being there for vulnerable and disadvantaged individuals, acknowledging the dignity and worth of people. Like those are all things that are super important to me. And so I'm happy to be in a role and in a career that like, just puts that at the forefront. But I think like my absolute favorite aspect of being a social worker is just hearing other people's stories, and witnessing their journeys. Because even though like, you know, I mentioned all those things before, like all the instrumental support that I do, a lot of the time, there isn't much that I can do, because of systemic inequities, or structural things that just prevent me from being able to really do a lot more, because they're just the resources just aren't out there. And sometimes, all you can really do is just listen, and be present for people who are experiencing really difficult transitions and challenges and loss. And, and, you know, before that used to really frustrate me, because I'm very much a doer, I'm very much a fixer. And I always thought that that was what social work was. But it wasn't really until I started my career fully that I realized that sometimes people just need a safe space to vent and share and release their stories in like a non-judgmental space. And I find that that's usually where I've felt really fulfilled when I when people have just kind of lowered their own boundaries, and have trusted me on that level to share some of their most vulnerable thoughts and build that rapport. So, I think that's my favorite aspect about being a social worker, just witnessing people's journeys and listening to their stories.

Ezi  08:42

I think that's an important thing to acknowledge, like, you know, sometimes we're in these professions that are held up as places where solutions are meant to be found; solutions for all the things right? I come to you for all of the answers [laughter]. And then sometimes you can't you can't give that but what can you give? Right?

09:04

Exactly. All you can do is sometimes just give a listening ear, and a non-judgmental, safe space. And just an opportunity for people just to share because, you know, especially with the population that I'm working with, they're caught up with managing their disease, and managing all of the day to day stressors of life, but sometimes they don't have that person. Even if they have a support system. Sometimes they don't feel comfortable, or they just don't even have the time to share with other people. And until they come, you know and see me and I just ask a simple question like, how are you doing? How are you managing? And it just kind of pours out and that feels, you know, really good for a lot of folks.

Ezi  09:52

So in terms of what prepared you to take up your role and to do the work of being a social worker, you are an alumni of u of t --alumna of uoft--. And so let's talk a little bit about your training at U of T. So what are some of the things that you think really helped you to take up your role? And maybe what are some of the things that you wish you had learned or wish you had gotten from the U of T environment that might not have been there?

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  10:18

For sure. So, you know, U of T has told me the Factor-Inwentash School of Social Work. They have some really awesome professors, some great simulations, and the connections to the community led to some really awesome and amazing placements. And through those placements, I had really knowledgeable and supportive supervisors, and they were instrumental in my growth as a social worker, they really pushed me and they really laid the groundwork for, you know, some of the foundational pieces that you need to have in order to do your job. So, you know, I learned how to do really comprehensive assessments, I learned how to write reports, you know, really use my critical thinking skills. And I also had the opportunity to really form friendships and networking and with other people, you know, who were pursuing their MSW. And to this day, I'm still in contact with them, and I have that community. You know, but then again, there's only so much you can learn from formal training. And there's only so much you can gain from placements. And I mean, to some degree, as a student, you're always going to be kind of protected from really complex situations and intense family dynamics. And, you know, so there's only so much school can prepare you for. But one thing I really wish that u of t, didn't get from u of t, was, and mind you I could have overlooked this, maybe there was a course or something that covered this topic, but I wish there was more discussion about grief and loss and what that looks like, on a regular basis for a lot of people. Because I think when we talk about grief and loss, you think about death and dying immediately, or a lot of people will think about death and dying immediately. But for a lot of people, you know, especially now I feel like the pandemic has maybe highlighted that on a global scale. But grief and loss actually looks like you know, loss of independence, loss of dreams, loss of, you know, particular hopes for yourself, loss of function, a loss of health, loss of career academic goals, you know. Loss of experience and time. And I don't think that, again, maybe this is something you can't really learn at school, you just have to learn it in the field itself. But I felt like that's something I wish I was better prepared for coming out of school. How to just navigate those conversations and how to just be present and be there for people who are grieving. You know, and recognizing what grief looks like. And another thing I think I kind of wish I got from U of T, I mean, I'll be very candid and very open, and I don't know how the Faculty has changed in terms of diversity. But you know, I really wish there was more...just more diversity in terms of the student body. And again, I was very happy with my cohort and the people that I did meet. And I established some really wonderful connections. But I also wonder what my experience would have been if I had maybe met other, or a lot more other Black MSW students, or Racialized students pursuing their MSW and what that would have looked like or what that network would have looked like.  So those are just, you know, some thoughts,just things.

Ezi  13:55

And I mean, definitely u of t is known for having diverse skill set in terms of professors and things like that, but not necessarily a diverse student body. And that's something that I'm, I'm open enough to say. But But really, so yeah, so definitely that that skill, that skill in terms of capacity for training. But I do think your point about grief is very interesting and well taken. Right? And I do think it's something that can be explored in academic space, because academic space of the space of questions, right, for sure. So it's a question that one could explore and very, very relevant to your field. So grief in terms of loss and loss in terms of many things. Not just life, right. Yeah. And and it's such a such a prescient point to make now in the type of COVID-19 as you're saying, where all of us are experiencing many losses: loss to our freedom, loss, loss of life, for sure, on a grand scale, and on disproportionate scale if we talk about you know, race and economic standing. But loss loss of our everyday. Loss of our normal.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  15:06

Yes, exactly.

Ezi  15:08

And in some ways that loss can be good too, right? For some people, their, their their normal was disrupted, to wake up to the social realities of many other people.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  15:19

Definitely, for sure, like, if you yourself, have lost your own routine or have experienced job insecurity in another way, you're able to relate to someone who maybe has lived this reality for a long time pre pandemic, right? For sure. For sure.

Ezi  15:37

Yeah. And then on the point of diversity, you know, I mean, this pandemic has also... how do we say because it was always there... but has also

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  15:47

Illuminated?

Ezi  15:48

Thank you. Thank you. [Laughter] Usually, I'm the wordsmith in this relationship, but I appreciate it. I appreciate you stepping up to take care of me in that moment [laughter]. So yes, to illuminate issues that always existed, but in terms of diversity, a lot of institutions are now stepping up to say, you know, let's have more! But yeah, it'd be interesting to see in, in the years to come, what that more really meant, in terms of quality rather than quantity. For sure. So, so definitely a point to take there. You know, as we talk about COVID-19, you know, and loss in terms of COVID-19. How has COVID-19, in particular affected your work for either better, or for worse, during these times?

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  16:39

Um, yeah, COVID definitely has been challenging, and has just been drastically, like, you know, affected my practice. I think the biggest change is the transition from, you know, in person visits to more telephone counseling, you know, do due to social distancing policies that are, that have been put in place to keep clients safe. You know, again, I work with folks who are chronically ill, and they're particularly vulnerable, you know? And oftentimes, they're self isolating to ensure that they remain well, during this pandemic. But unfortunately, you know, so much of social work practice is dependent on nonverbal communication, right? Like body language or facial expressions. And that's really hard to gauge if the individual is not in front of you, or if there isn't any video conferencing capacities. So sometimes it's really hard to build trust and rapport. If you're reaching out to someone over the phone for the first time, like, how can I make you feel safe if you've never met me before? Or, you know, how can I make you feel comfortable if, like, I'm just a voice on the other end of a phone? So what I've had to do is I've really had to learn how to pace, you know, the therapeutic relationship, and just ensure that clients really trust me and feel comfortable answering some of these, like, really vulnerable, vulnerable questions over the phone. Right. So yeah, very personal questions. So I'm just kind of slowing that down and meeting clients where they're at. In terms of positives, I am quite I'm still jaded [laughter]. Yeah, I can't really see, you know.

Ezi  18:39

That's fair. That's fair.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  18:40

Yeah, but I will say that I think it has exposed how fragile, you know, society is and how fragile some of these structures that were in place are, and how things can change overnight, you know, because it really did, it doesn't have felt like at work. And, you know, it has expedited some well needed changes, and innovations, in order to make services more available for people. But I think there's still a lot that needs to be done in terms of like accessibility and Equity and Inclusion to ensure like really good outcomes for people, especially those who are really, really affected by the pandemic.

Ezi  19:22

Right, and we talk about those who are really affected; those who are disproportionately affected. We talk about that in terms of, I'm always hesitant to say ability, I'm still trying myself to search for new words for that, but you know, differently abled, or commonly said disabled people, but also in terms of race, right race and class. And all these things are not necessarily working on their own, oftentimes together. So on this on this platform, particularly, we talk about Black, Indigenous and Racialized people, and so in your capacity it'd be patients or clients. So for those populations in particular, what are some things that you've noticed around their specific needs? Perhaps in times of COVID? Or before? And then  hopefully in the, hopefully in the after? Right? And what are some of the things that you've seen in terms of their specific needs, ways in which maybe care can be improved and made more equitable? Let's talk about that.Let's talk about that.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  20:24

For sure. Um, you know, I think, if anything, as you said, you know, the pandemic has really highlighted a lot of the social inequities and health inequities that exist. And so I think, when working with Black, Indigenous and Racialized people, you really need to acknowledge the history of healthcare, and the history of social work with various communities, and how there's been or likely been a history of trauma, there's a history of misdiagnosis, it's a lot of like, inhumane things have been done to a lot of these communities, which have led to mistrust. So you have to be cognizant of how to not perpetuate some of that, you know, or retraumatize people in health care spaces, you really have to meet individuals where they're at. And you have to acknowledge how social determinants of health play out, and how the experiences I think of racialized folks how that affects their access to health care, and how if they're, you know, essentially disadvantaged in some areas, how that can spill over into how their disease is managed, or how their disease progresses. Also, just, again, acknowledging just in general, racial stress, racial microaggressions, and how that like, overall impacts individuals as well. Um, to be honest, I don't know what the real fix is. But I do feel like there are more conversations that's happening around it. And there needs to be a lot more training and support amongst staff to ensure that, you know, black, indigenous and racialized clients are getting equitable health care to ensure good outcomes.

Ezi  22:42

Right. And, yeah, I mean, you know, I talk about this all the time. Oh, yeah. So you know, and some other people might not know, I, and Janelle Brady and Shawnee Hardware, do a lot of trainings, we don't often call them trainings, but workshops and consulting around equity, diversity, inclusion, and justice, but also anti racism, and in particular, anti black racism. And, you know, when I when I hear the word training, I always like flinch, because I'm like, you can't, because people have gotten into this...I'm gonna say lackadaisical framework where they think that you can train away racism. Right? And, and which is, which it goes to show....It goes to show kind of where our priorities lie. Because it's like, Okay, my priority for today is to take this training and be done, rather than, like really doing the consistent work. And so I think like, in particular, medical spaces, like one of the biggest awakenings, that I think needs to happen is that there is a culture of distrust that has been built through scientific racism, or medical racism. And that continues to continue to exist. On episode not too far ago, we were talking about you know, what happened with an indigenous mother Joyce, recently, right? Where, where she was ignored, given medicine that she was allergic to, belittled as she was dying, right? And these come out of histories of things like forced sterilization of indigenous and black women like, yeah, you know, Tuskegee, a big case in the States. But, you know, also just globally, like trying out new medications on on black people in Africa in particular, right. So when we're talking about the vaccines, and everyone's just like, Oh, don't be silly, you have to take it. Like really understanding that it's not just silliness, right? There's an actual history of hurt, that was perpetuated by healthcare system.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  24:58

Exactly.

Ezi  24:59

So definitely where you talk about like, you know, training and taking care and being intentional about out those relationships is important.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  25:08

Yes, for sure. And acknowledging and just recognizing that, like, a lot of that historical trauma and even present a trauma has impacted how people interact with healthcare systems, or if they avoid healthcare systems in general, just because they've had horrible experiences themselves, or have known people that look like them that have had horrible experiences. So we really need to be sensitive and aware, to ensure that you're not perpetuating and retraumatizing people.

Ezi  25:51

But certainly, they're lucky to have someone like you. [Laughter]

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  25:57

Thank you! It helps to have lived experience. It helps identify as a black woman, you know? So I think that definitely my, my lived experience, how I identify has helped me with my own lens.

Ezi  26:15

So definitely, the message to folks listening is hire more Jeahlisas. [Laughter] Um, but I mean, for you, right, we just talked about you, particularly as a black woman, and like the need to recognize thriving, right, where it's possible. So for you, what does it mean to live and to be well?

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  26:36

So I think, you know, just through my years of working in healthcare, I've realized that living and being well is much more than, you know, the absence of a medical diagnosis or a disease, I think there are a lot of dimensions to wellness. For me, I, you know, I think it means access to healthy food; means shelter; it means access to medications, livable income, good sleeping habits, balanced emotional health, the presence of community, meaningful relationship with relationships with others, you know, family chosen family, an ability to cope, and have access to tools and strategies that will help me cope in the face of adversity, you know, a sense of purpose and belonging. So I mentioned the presence of community, but I want to feel like I belong to that community. And there's a purpose as well for me, and just finding pleasure in day to day activities. And, you know, again, because I work in health care, like quality of life is something that comes up a lot as well. And I think it also really corresponds with with wellness, you know, because sometimes, you may not hit all of those things that I mentioned, that are important to me, but can you...do you think that you still have a good quality of life? You know, do your goals and your values correspond with like your current reality? And if it doesn't, are there ways in which you can, you know, implement these goals and values in your life? Is there like a plan in place? Or are there identifiable next steps for you to achieving that? And so that's why I think like, you know, for, for now, a lot of people during the pandemic aren't doing so well, because there's a lot of uncertainty. And there's, there isn't a lot of things that people can look forward to, because they don't know when things will open back up. They don't know when some of these restrictions will be removed, or diminished, you know, and that really impacts your sense of control. And your and your ability to maybe live a meaningful life on your own terms. So yeah, I think I mean, wellness is all of those things I mentioned. But I think it's also being able to just meet certain goals for yourself, and live out, you know, some of your own truthsand your own values.

Ezi  29:19

And I mean, like you mentioned, right now, there's so much uncertainty. So what is something that you perhaps tell others when you're working with them about still thriving and even in the face of that uncertainty?

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  29:31

For sure. I To be honest, I feel like it's something I'm figuring out myself as we're going along. Yeah, this is, as the news would say, unprecedented times.

29:44

Mm hmm. [Laughter] As the news would say! [Laughter] Yes.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  29:47

You know, it's a trigger word. But you know, I think a lot of things, much of what you can do, or the only thing you really can do is just as cliche It sounds try to live in the moment and take it day by day. And, you know, some of the things that I'll encourage people to do is make it a goal to try to get a good night's rest, eat good foods, you know, practice good hygiene, and move around and get fresh air, like do things that hopefully will make you feel better, will make you look better. So that overall, you can just feel a bit more well, compared to maybe how you were feeling before. Do things that bring a little bit of pleasure to your life, you know, listen to music, read books, watch TV. You know, stay away from triggers, you know, if that trigger happens to be social media or the news, because of all the influx of information, like try to disconnect or place boundaries, you know, that really protect your overall mental health and well being, you know, and protect your own peace. I think, you know, trying to find community is really hard for a lot of people, but just maybe trying to connect with your loved ones, spiritually or those within your bubble. And, you know, again, I know with uncertainty, it's hard to plan ahead or super far ahead. But even if you just make a daily, daily, small goals, daily goals. So to kind of give you a sense of accomplishment, in a way, you know, the goal could easily just be like today, I'm going to get up and take a shower and do my hair and make myself you know, try to make myself feel good. And if that's the goal, then try to accomplish it so that at least it feels like you're progressing, you're moving forward in some way, shape, or form. And I don't have the magic answers. I'll be honest, I'm navigating this space.

Ezi  32:00

I mean, like the answer seems pretty magic to me. [Laughter] Yeah, I mean, as we take care of ourselves and try when we can, and if we can to take care of others. What is what is care even mean? Right? What are the some ways? You know, we can help take care of others, but not deplete ourselves, too? So what is care?

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  32:26

So yeah, I mean, I think that's a really tough question, because we throw out the word care all the time, especially in health care. [Laughter]

Ezi  32:36

It's in the name?

32:37

Yeah, pretty much, right. And, you know, I've never really been asked to define it before, but I guess in general, you know, to me,  [care] means practicing compassion. Just being understanding and empathetic to other individuals. Protecting one's safety or on another person's safety, or enhancing their safety. Supporting their autonomy, and trying to be collaborative, and respecting their values and their boundaries. Helping how you can. Just acting in someone else's best interest, because you might have your own definition of what it means to care for that person, but that person might need care in a different way. So like, asking them what they would need. or asking them or collaborating with them to ensure that, you know, you're incorporating their needs into how you care for them. Just providing comfort, listening. Those are I think, ways that I define care. And again, it looks different for different people, right, just depending on what you what that person needs at the time.

Ezi  33:54

Yeah, I think it's really important that you say that, you know, what we might think a person needs or how we might think to care for a person might not actually be how to care for that person. And I think about that a lot, because, you know, sometimes when you're trying to help somebody that desire to want to help can actually get in the way of helping, because you're not listening. Right? Or you're at you're looking to solve something. So yeah, in terms of your work, like, what are some lessons around that that you've seen?

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  34:31

So, I mean, I, again, I think one of the biggest lessons I've learned in my work is you really do have to meet people where they're at, and you have to actually ask them what they need. Because, as you mentioned, you know, as helping professionals we may have like a plan. This is what you need to do X Y Zed in order to achieve "wellness" or to achieve "optimal health". But that person may be living a different reality that we can't understand. And they might have different priorities that maybe don't seem a priority to us. But it's come, you know, if they don't get that, if they don't prioritize the way that they want things to be done, then it's going to affect their relationship with their healthcare team, it's going to affect their ability to, you know, listen, or maybe adhere. I don't really like the word adhere, but adhere to like, medical advice, because I have something else on the go, right now, that's taking up a lot of my mental energy, you know? I can't be bothered with these medications, if I don't have money, you know, or if, you know, you know? So there's other things or if my kids need support, if I'm worried about childcare, you know? There's so many things. So you really do have to meet people where they're at and just kind of work with them, and collaborate with them. And set aside your own personal agenda, set aside your own goals, and ask them what their own goals are. And even if there's a pause, or they need time to really think about it, give them the space and time to think about it, and then follow up and allow them to follow up with it another time. You know, try not to put you may have suggestions. And obviously, those suggestions are important to their overall well being. But you also have to be able to incorporate what's important to them, or find like a common ground and middle ground, you know, a common place where we can incorporate their values. And what we're recommending, as a healthcare professional. Other lessons that I've also learned about care is, you know, you can't solve all the problems in the world. Because sometimes, you know, the solution is really rooted in systemic inequities. And all you can do is just kind of hold space and just be present and validate people. And that's sometimes all you can do. And that's okay. That's another form of caring, you know, just listening to people. I also feel that, you know, I think you've mentioned it earlier, I don't remember your exact wording, but you had mentioned that, you know, you really can't pour from an empty cup. So, you know, caregiver burnout is real, compassion fatigue is real. And you have to preserve yourself in the process of providing care for other people. Because if you're not caring for yourself, and you're feeling burnt out, and you're not feeling well, then the quality of your work, and your ability to really provide quality care is going to be diminished, if you're not feeling it, if you're not feeling well, emotionally, or mentally or physically. So you really do have to, like self care is super important. And it's not selfish to practice self care, because if you don't, then the care you're providing to other people is probably not be helpful.

Ezi  38:17

Yeah, I mean, compassion fatigue is something that we're seeing a lot more posts and articles about, especially in this time, right, where, you know, everybody's trying to dial in and take care of each other. But it's such a, it's such a draining time on each of us anyway. So definitely, like that importance about self care and like, you know, bubble bath or not, lots of ways to do it, right? We've been talking about, we've been talking about boba as, like, self care on a lot of the episodes and like, self care, but also like, empty like, don't just do bubble baths for self-care. Like every episode will be like tagged bubble bath because it comes up in like every other episode. [Laughter].

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  39:01

That works for me! [Laughter].

Ezi  39:04

Definitely, like, you can't pour from an empty cup. You know that age old adage?  For sure. For sure. Um, so we like to give everyone their Mic drop moment on this show. [Laughter]. I will find another name for it. But for now, the mic drop moment. [Laughter] Um, so what is one takeaway that you want to share for anyone who's listening just as you, just as we close out the episode?

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  39:36

I think if anything, you know, this pandemic has just made us realize that we're a lot of people, if not majority of people, are social beings, on some level, and we really do need social interaction, face to face interaction, touch to really thrive. And you know, I already knew this before the pandemic, but family systems, and I use family like loosely because obviously you can be chosen family as well as blood relatives, but family and community support systems are so important for people to be well. And, an absence of that can really affect them on so many levels. So, it's incredibly important to just continue to reach out and support each other during you know, these really difficult times, mind you, of course, ensuring that you're okay, emotionally and taking space that you need in order to ensure that you're, you're well, but as long as you're feeling well, you know, continue just to reach out and just be there for one another.

Ezi  41:02

Yeah, definitely. And, I mean, the reach out part is, is an incredible privilege to have people to reach out to and you know, it's also a point for being grateful, you know, because some people don't have that system.  And, and, you know, maybe if you can, like volunteering at organizations who help with, you know, creating community for other folks who don't have that community that we have. So certainly a thing to do you know, instead of maybe buying gifts. Give the gift of your time

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  41:40

Definitely: of your presenc, of communication.

Ezi  41:43

Down with capitalism! [Laughter]

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  41:50

Works for me!

Ezi  41:51

Works for me, boo. Works for me. I'm born on Christmas, and it works for me. [Laughter] In another life, I was the Grinch and possibly Eeyore, [Laughter] but it works for me certainly. But ya know, definitely. You know, even Winnie the Pooh had a collective so everybody take care of your people. Really reach out, reach out. So on that note, thank you for being in my community and thank you for taking good care of me and those around, but also others who you know who are out there who who rely on you in a professional capacity.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  42:28

Thank you so much Ezi.

Ezi  42:30

Thank you for being on this show my good friend Jeahlisa.

Jeahlisa Bridgeman  42:33

Oh! [Laughter trails off]

Ezi  42:40

Did I tell you she was awesome? Tell the people that you love, that you love them. And that includes you. In any case, take good, good care. Bye for now.